Transcript #021- Purpose

#021 - Sharad Lal - Healing with Purpose - Episode Transcript

Sharad Lal: [00:00:00] I read all I could and talked to as many people as I could to find the answer. And the answer was surprisingly simple. Like everything has a different version. Of the same thing. And that thing is that the path to life, the way you're supposed to live life lies deep inside you. We know within what we need to do in order to live a good life.

And many people have different words for it. For me, that's purpose.

Amanda Parker: Welcome to Don't Step on the Blue Bells, the podcast where personal healing and transformation take center stage. I'm your host, Amanda Parker, and I'm a fellow seeker on the journey of personal growth. Join me as I delve into the stories of gifted healers, guides, and everyday people who have experienced remarkable transformations.

Listen in as they share their practical wisdom to enrich your everyday life. And don't forget to hit subscribe and never miss a new episode. [00:01:00] Welcome to today's episode of Don't Step on the Blue Bells. I am here with the wonderful Sharad Lal, who also happens to be a very good friend of mine. Sharad is an entrepreneur.

He's a keynote speaker. He's a coach. He's really a remarkable man who has worn many hats over the years. And I'm super grateful because we've had the chance to cross paths over many different occasions throughout our careers, uh, over the last six years or so. Um, you're really someone who has inspired me with every step that you're taking in your career, in your business and what you're growing, especially with your incredible podcast, How to Live.

So Sharad, I am so happy to have you here today on the podcast. Thank you for being here.

Sharad Lal: Thank you very much, Amanda. It's a huge honor to be in your podcast. Um, you bring so much of positive energy to this world, and I'm so glad that you're doing it through your podcast [00:02:00] now.

Amanda Parker: Thank you. And I have to say a little side note, I'm going to give you credit for helping me to get started with the podcast.

Uh, Sharad began his podcast a couple of years ago and I was really just in awe of what you were creating. And it was almost like this light bulb went off because there was this sort of idea in my head, Ooh, I want to do that, but I had no idea how. And then suddenly. someone I knew was doing it and doing it really well.

And I could actually say, Hey, Sharad, how do I get this started? So all of us here listening can give some credit to Sharad for kicking off Don't Step on the Blue Bells.

Sharad Lal: Thank you, Amanda. I'm happy to be of any help to you and happy to have played a small role in your podcast.

Amanda Parker: So we're here today to talk about the topic of purpose and healing with purpose.

And I know that this is something you've really been focusing a lot of your speaking and engagement with corporates and clients [00:03:00] and different things that you do in the world, really talking about what does it mean to live a purposeful life. So maybe before we start really diving into the conversation, you could tell us what purpose actually means to you.

Sharad Lal: So maybe I'll start with a little story of what got me into purpose. And then, uh, from that it could flow. So a little context of myself. I grew up in a small little town in India. And, uh, growing up in that little town, uh, my horizons were limited, but then something changed in that town, cable television, this was in the eighties.

And the first time I saw people, you know, from the West living in beautiful houses, jet setting around the world. And I said to myself, that's the way to live life. So I put my head down and my path out to this beautiful life that I saw was working hard. So I worked hard, stood first in class, got into a good college, good university, good companies after that, Procter Gamble, Boston Consulting Group.

And then I started multiple businesses. So for [00:04:00] me, that was the way to live life. You know, one achievement after another gives you more. And that's what the game of life is. Then in 2013. Um, I suffered a very unfortunate loss. Um, I lost family members close to me, which just completely shattered my world.

And it took me many years to heal from it. And during the healing process, I started questioning just this mindset of living. If we are to go and have all these achievements in our darkest moments, these don't help. And I remember moments sitting alone in my house, just looking around, and there were these branded items and luxurious things that were accumulated over the years.

And I asked myself, do these really matter? And that started a journey on what matters in life. How should we live our life? And I started reading on spirituality, going to yoga, going to meditation, philosophy, psychology. I read all I could and talked to as many people as I could to find the answer. And the answer was [00:05:00] surprisingly simple.

Like everything has a different version. Of the same thing. And that thing is that the path to life, the way you're supposed to live life lies deep inside you. We know within what we need to do in order to live a good life. And many people have different words for it. For me, that's purpose. And that's the first time I connected with, there is something deeper in life.

Which is the way, which is our guide to live life. And we don't do that because we've always been looking externally. At least me. Achievements one after another, you get positive reinforcement from people around you. You keep doing that. And over a period of time, you're living for claps. You're living for approval, respect, but you lose touch with what's really important to you.

And when you can start doing that, that's when you can bring out a life of purpose. So that's how I connected to purpose.

Amanda Parker: That's really beautiful and thank you for sharing that. So I know for anyone who's curious to hear a bit more of [00:06:00] Sharad's story, he shares more of these, yeah, really heartfelt and heart wrenching details in episode one, I believe, of your podcast.

So you have to go back a bit in time, but I've known you for a few years, but I had no idea this story that got you on this path to what you're doing now and just being, I have goosebumps even now, just really being amazed at how you were able to take these different circumstances in life and even the achievement orientation, which I know people listening can relate to and turn that into, can I like rest my head on this on a dark day?

No, this isn't the thing that's actually giving me. soul sustenance for lack of a better word. So I really admire that at a young age, and I say young age because it doesn't matter how old you are, but you still have so much life, you know, like there's still so much more

Sharad Lal: qualified that [00:07:00] well.

Amanda Parker: Well, but it is really true. It's like you could have had this realization in your 80s. But you didn't, so you actually get to live it out and to help other people to find that too.

Sharad Lal: Yes.

Amanda Parker: Thinking of this perspective of. what purpose means or what it really means to have this purposeful life. Coming into the context of Don't Step on the Blue Bells where we're really talking about healing and transformation and how you can reconnect with yourself in a way when you've been lost or when things don't feel right and coming back home.

I hear it a bit in your story, but And how, what does it mean to heal through purpose? How can that help someone to heal?

Sharad Lal: Right. Great question, Amanda. And during that healing process, I was, I'd never been in a situation like that. So I was trying different things. And one of the things that I'd always heard of growing up in life [00:08:00] was positive thinking that maybe something terrible has happened to you, but look at the silver lining, look at what's positive out there and look and change your mindset there.

But that didn't work for me. Because there was nothing positive in what had happened to me. So that kind of thinking didn't work. Then there were some people who said, all right, fake it. Like go out and be happy. You want to see a smile in your face, go out, party, do these things. But I felt lonely doing that.

And happiness didn't work for me. So I realized I'm in this deep, dark hole. Happiness is not going to get me out, nor are my achievements like I talked about earlier. And I was wondering what is going to get me out. And then I remember a few moments of healing. I had a friend of mine took me to a chakra cleansing yoga class.

I'd never done yoga before. So I went to this class and I'm like breathing in and out. And suddenly I start crying in front of everyone. And that surprises me because I don't cry and that too not in public. But what surprised me [00:09:00] even more was that it felt beautiful. It felt therapeutic, all the pain and emotion that I was holding back and trying to put away and look at positive stuff.

All those deep, dark feelings came pouring out and they released. And I felt lighter. And that, to me, is one moment I could realize where the process of healing had started. And I feel when you're absolutely down in the trenches, there is one part which needs to be done first, which is processing the emotions.

Because there's overwhelm, there's all kinds of emotions. And without processing it, we cannot move forward, in my view. Because we could put a band aid and try to move forward, and maybe sometimes practically we need to do that. you That's not healing. So facing, stepping into the darkness, feeling it, feeling that difficult emotion.

And for me, it was feeling pure, unadulterated sadness for the first time in my life, which started the journey for others. It could be anger. It could be [00:10:00] anything else. So when you're in the dark hole, that for me is a step on surrendering, letting go and feeling that emotion. Once you do that, I think we get a little more access to our intellect.

And if you look at some of the spiritual guidance out there, the Bhagavad Gita is a book for the Hindus, which talks about once you process your emotion, once you get that out, then you can access your intellect and find resourceful ways to get out of there. When I did that, then I also Connected with what really is important to me.

I had a lot of time to think I could be fearless and realize teaching is something that I really like and that then got me out. So it was like a purpose that hey, I need to go out and teach people. This gives me fulfillment that finally got me out and moved me on the path. So it's a summary way of putting it like how.

From those, in that dark place, how I got out through purpose, through connecting with something that's important.

Amanda Parker: Modern society teaches us that we need to just keep going, kind of at any cost. Obviously like Gen Z and [00:11:00] younger generations are getting it. They're like, no, we're not living our life that way.

But for a large part of the population, we, we think we have to just. move on with it because that's sort of what's been role modeled before. And so you see a lot of people just self medicating, whatever that looks like. Maybe that's drinking. Maybe that's taking whatever anti anxiety medicine or Um, just not really facing what's happening.

What would you say maybe to someone who's sitting in a dark place and they're looking to find that connection and they are so terrified of feeling those feelings that all they want to do is numb it?

Sharad Lal: Yes. I completely understand that. And I think at some stage we have to face the dark feelings. Uh, but having said that we need not rush to it because sometimes it could be too overwhelming to go there and be not ready.

So I would say to them, take your time. [00:12:00] If during the process right now, many of us have needs like we may be suffering, but we need to go out and work to get put money, put food on the table for our family. We have other practical considerations in those situations. It's okay to put some sort of a bandaid and go on for a while.

Get some relief through Netflix, get some, um, ways in which you can actually take your mind off. Sometimes humor helps, sometimes going out with friends, whatever it is for you, get that release through band aids. I think that's fine because we need to be practical as well. But at some stage, if we have to move forward, we have to confront the darkness.

And the way to confront it is look at what really is coming up. It's like emotional awareness. What's coming up? What is this thing that's, that's preventing us from going forward? And quite often it's sadness or some version of it and sit in it. Now, when you read sit in it, it gets difficult. You don't know what to do.

But if you're acknowledge it, you will find a way. Like I never [00:13:00] knew going for a chakra cleansing yoga class will help me feel my sadness, but it did. And sitting with it for me meant like doing that breathing and just crying out of nowhere. So it could mean anything for any person. But if we acknowledge the feelings without saying, Hey, I'm, I'm, I'm okay.

I'm fine. I'm going. If you acknowledge, I'm not okay. There are some parts of me that are broken, which need mending. Okay. and we are aware of it, we will have the time to sit with it when it's right, because that needs to be processed before we move forward.

Amanda Parker: Well, but I'm also hearing, or maybe I'm bringing this in myself, but there seems to be this element of making sure you have the support around you that you need to do that.

So feeling Yes, and that there's people you know that you can call or rely on or to be there with you in some capacity like the friend who brought you to the yoga class that you know you're not going to face this [00:14:00] alone because that might be really

Sharad Lal: Absolutely. That's such a good point, Amanda. I think community and people who will help you through is really important.

But the interesting thing that I learned is the people who you think are the ones who are going to be the most helpful may not be, and it may not be that they have bad intentions, but imagine your loved one going through something so difficult. That all you want to do is put a smile on that person's face.

All you want to do is make that person come out of that trenches, you know? So the people around you who really care for you are trying to just lift you up when you may not be ready for it. And that may not be the support that you need. And I like the way Renee Brown puts it in, in, in a book on vulnerability, where she says, it's those folks who say that I will come down to the, I'm not going to lift you up from the trenches.

I'll come down and sit with you in the trenches, and we'll sit as long as you want. And when you're ready [00:15:00] to get up, I will get up with you. So that type of support is difficult to get, and that's the one you need to look at. And it's very difficult, I think, for our loved ones to give it to us, because they're so invested in us.

So quite often, it's the second order friends, the third order friends, people who've gone through similar experiences, who come and give us that support. And I think a good way of looking at it is at that stage, it's very important to manage our community. If someone who, even though they're close to us is bringing us down, they're in constant, they are anxious around us for us and are not helpful, even though their intentions may be good.

We need to move away from them for this time. And we need to seek the people who are, who are the ones who are giving us the right energy. was sitting with us where we are, meeting us exactly where we are and helping us move forward.

Amanda Parker: That's such a good point. And as you're saying that, it's really clear that not only is that doing, I want to say a mitzvah, that's [00:16:00] Yiddish for like a good deed.

So it's a mitzvah for them and for you. So not putting yourself in a position to be the support for someone you can't really wholeheartedly support gives them the opportunity to find people who can with loving open arms. So it's actually, it works both ways in your life today. How does this work around purpose Show up.

So I know you do speaking and other things, but I'd love to hear from you. What does that actually look like now?

Sharad Lal: So as I started delving into purpose and understanding it better and working with people who go to workshops with people I get feedback from them and understand universally I'm getting a better understanding of purpose.

So I a few things have come out of that first I feel we don't have one purpose in life for me And when you look at one grand purpose, it becomes very difficult to achieve it. And because it's so overwhelming, we give up. So that's why, or we spend our [00:17:00] whole life looking for that one purpose. We're just looking and looking for what that purpose is.

I find the approach of filling our life with purposeful activities. Very helpful. So there already are purposeful activities that we are doing. We may not be aware of it, but once we look and find them and have a life that has many of these small, simple, beautiful, purposeful activities, that's the way to think about purpose.

So that's one thing that I found. The second thing that I found related to the first is there is purpose in our lives hidden in there. So it's not adding a new activity because all of us have the temptation. What else can I do? Can I add meditation on top? Can I add yoga on top? But if anything, I would say remove.

Exactly. Can you? We can't. We're so busy. I would say remove stuff from, from, from your life. Take it out. It's easier to take something out and see what is giving you purpose. By purpose, it is what's giving you that feeling of fulfillment. [00:18:00] So if it's work, let's say we're doing work beyond pay, beyond other things.

Sometimes we get fulfillment on things that we may have forgotten, like solving a problem, it comes up so often when we do purpose at work, people look at, I thought about that problem for days. And sometimes I was angry, irritated, not necessarily in the state of flow, but I was just trying to solve it and solve it.

And when I solved it. That feeling of satisfaction, that is purposeful. Something as simple as solving a problem, growth, going, adding a new level of skill. When we see now I can do this, wow, I've grown. So at a self level, people find purpose in satisfaction, something that's fulfilling, something that helps us grow at a group or a team or a community level.

It's belonging that gives purpose. How do I feel connected with a group? And the way to do that based on the work that I've done is figuring out how can I contribute and be useful to the group? [00:19:00] Like often we say, Hey, the group needs to be inclusive. So whether the group is your family, friends, work, how can, what is my role?

And how is that role adding value and making this a little better? These could be simple things. I could be the one who adds, who cracks the funny joke and just lifts up people's spirit. That could be the role that I play. I could be the one on the opposite side, asking difficult questions. People don't like me, but I have a role to play because it makes them think.

You know, and there's so many beautiful stories that have come having someone's back, you know, there's different ways to play that role. So I think whether it is solving problem at an individual level or a team level, we can find purpose. Ultimately that then leads to impact. So it starts, so it's, it's a two pronged approach.

It's something that gives us something, whether it is through problems or through teams. So it gives us fulfillment and it has an impact outside. So it starts inside, but has an impact outside. Someone's day [00:20:00] better. It makes the world a little better. You know, it adds something new to the world that to me is purpose.

Amanda Parker: Well, I really appreciate you saying that, um, about, well, in particular about like, we don't have that one singular purpose that we're just trying to work towards and figure it out. And, you know, by the end of our life, we'll have figured out that one purpose and we'll have done it. Um, it reminds me, I think I mentioned this to you on a, a workshop I was By now it's like two months ago with Elizabeth Gilbert, and she was here for two days in London.

It was a creativity workshop. It was beautiful. She used a lot of like unconventional methods and letter writing to help us connect to our inner selves. And on day one, she said, this is not a life purpose workshop. You will not leave this workshop with your purpose intact. And she had mentioned that idea.

It was sort of the first time I had heard the concept of like purpose, anxiety that so many of us are like walking through life, [00:21:00] feeling so anxious because we don't know. who we are and what we're supposed to be doing. And if I could just find that purpose or almost like if someone could just hand me my purpose on a silver platter, then I would know what I'm supposed to do in my life.

So I think this feeling is very prevalent.

Sharad Lal: And then what happens with purpose anxiety is you flip your life around, like, Hey, this corporate world doesn't work for me. I need to find purpose. I'm going to quit. I'm going to go in the mountains. I'm going to start a library or do something there, which may or may not work for you.

But It's coming from a place of anxiety where you're totally going from one lopsided view of looking at life to another. Whereas what you might need to do is just a few little tweaks or even shift your mindset, you could still be doing the same thing, but you come with it from a different place. So I think purpose anxiety can make us do drastic things.

And that's where things go wrong. Honestly,

Amanda Parker: Shahrod, you're describing the last few years for me. [00:22:00] But I really do see myself in what you've just said, because There was a piece of me that was like, I can't work in corporate. I can't do this anymore. And no matter what I won't, and then moving into having my own business and all these things.

I mean, that's another story for another day, but the freedom and the ability to decide what I do and who I work with, et cetera, but it's almost like the person who takes. a spiritual pathway and they want to become a monk and they go up into the mountainside to live in the monastery or the, I guess it's not called a monastery, is it?

Sharad Lal: Yeah, it is, it is a monastery. Good.

Amanda Parker: So they go into the mountain to live there and that's great. And that is one meaningful way to live. Yes. But how are you bringing it back down to people who also need it, who are suffering? And I think for me, that's been a lot of that journey. Yeah. Okay. I did a big, you know, I'm not going back to corporate, but actually there's a lot of people who need support and they're working in corporate jobs.

And it's [00:23:00] not, you can't separate human beings and what they need in the world from where their workplace is or what they do to earn a living.

Sharad Lal: Absolutely. I like your point of bringing it back to people where quite often it's not, we need to do the connecting of the dots for ourselves, that storytelling to ourselves on how we are bringing it to people because it's not necessarily always this big tangible thing.

And maybe I can share an example. One of the workshops that I did, uh, there was a guy who'd actually attended three of my workshops in different times where he was the guy who did, um, he did the supply chain. So he created the supply chain. He was a very intellectual guy, and he felt his purpose was creating these systems, these beautiful systems that work so well and the intellectual stimulation he gets from that system.

The next time he came, he says, Hmm, it's not creating the system. But it's through the system people develop when people use the system it's guardrails for them it challenges them the [00:24:00] right way and they develop and they become better. So i'm actually creating people not the system so that's where he went to as the second level and when he did the third workshop he said.

I see these guys and i've he'd had a long career for 30 years i see these guys who've left this company gone to other companies they go out and shine and they've done so well in this world some have become ceo So my purpose is sending these wonderful people to the world to make it a better place.

And that's his purpose. So it was, he was already doing it, but he was connecting the dots and he started from a very technical area to an area of impact. And the impact need not be a tree that we've planted or something that we've done, which is also good to do, but the impact could be a lot more subtle.

And if he sit down and do the. We connect the dots with what we're doing and how it's impacting the world. We can find our impact because it's always there.

Amanda Parker: That framing is really powerful. So it's not about going out and finding the purpose. [00:25:00] It's actually like seeing what you're already doing that gives satisfaction.

And as you just said, creating that story for yourself so that you understand how that is impactful or purposeful for you. Yes,

Sharad Lal: absolutely.

Amanda Parker: Can you give us like a little cheat sheet of how we can identify what we're doing ourselves already? Is there a specific exercise you might do for that?

Sharad Lal: What I do is I do similar to inner journey meditation types, because the overall objective is all of us are so externally focused that we're looking at the next target after another.

And my job then is to Start removing all the noise. Let's cancel the noise, cancel the noise, cancel the noise. And we go excavating. And typically when you do long meditation retreats, that's what happens. Everything gets canceled and you go within and see what's important to you. And when I guide people, they connect with moments where they've gotten fulfillment.

And that's when they connect with things like solving problems, solving or [00:26:00] working with a team or having a team like this, where they work late, they connect with one part, whether it's team or problem, they connect with that. And then step two is getting them to think how that is impacting others. Quite often during the meditation, it happens and they see it, the baton on their own, or sometimes we tell them, all right, now what's this impact to the rest of the team that you work with?

What's the impact beyond the team? What's it beyond your company to the world, you know, and once you start doing it, it comes to you. Sometimes you don't even need to do this linear exercise when you're actually in the inner journey and removing the noise. You can just see it very clearly what you've done very, very clearly your role becomes clear.

And there's so many examples that come. I mean, I can go on talking about many more examples that come out of people who maybe I'll quote one example, which is very interesting. A guy in. He's in the credit role in the bank and in credit, you basically have to say no all the time that, Hey, this proposal, we will not do it because the bank's going to lose [00:27:00] money.

People hate those guys that every time I want to sell business, this guy doesn't let me do it. And his, and he thought that people are not going to have a good perception of me. They're going to think that they hate me. But then as he thought later, he realized, no, I'm actually not saying no to business.

I'm saying yes to the right business we should do. Because when I've looked at things properly, the business development guy is so confident that the downside risk is taken into account that they will go and sell in full vigor. So I stand in line with that. And if I'm not doing my job properly, they could let the bank go.

So that kind of helped him reframe that even though visibly he's not, people don't look at him highly, he's actually playing a very critical role and actually has the respect from other people. Which may not seem so. That's the story. So his story flipped, flipped from being like the bad guy to, I'm such an important person.

Amanda Parker: It's just, it's funny because we have all these narratives and honestly, I think most of us that are just [00:28:00] influenced from the world around us, whether it's Instagram or TikTok or LinkedIn has become a marketplace of like self congratulation. Yes. Um, where you're seeing people living out their purpose or even telling lies about what their lives look like.

And you know, I started my business and was earning 20k a week and whatever. So you start to believe that you're somehow doing something wrong. And I think that reinforces, like, in the same way that. Celebrity culture maybe has done that 20 years ago where you're always looking to this ideal that you can't ever really attain.

So you can never really live up to it. This whole social media influencer world gives us this feeling that we're not really doing the right things or we're not doing enough or somehow we could be. Throwing it all to the wind more, and that might just create a lot of destabilization and further unhappiness if you can't pay your [00:29:00] bills, no matter how passionate you are about the thing you're following, you're going to be in distress.

Sharad Lal: I'd add to that. So I think of course that perfect lifestyle that we see across social media puts the wrong kind of pressure and the, and the wrong kind of objectives for us to make our story. Uh, that's why it's not authentic. I think one of the other things that I've seen because of social media, because if you then finally decide, I want to be a good person and do good for humanity, you might just pick a cause that's available out there, which may not be true to you, but it would seem good from an optic standpoint.

And many people come to some really good causes, but not from deep within. And that gets known later. So you could be. positioning yourself as the sustainability person, but you've gotten, because that's the new trend. And you think, Hey, I want to be good. So I go there without starting internally, whether I'm really care for the planet and it comes from there, you know, so there's a difference between that.

So because of social media, we could have optics [00:30:00] around causes around rights, which people might think, all right, I'm looking at a purpose. This is the menu available. Let me pick sustainability. Let me pick, let's say pets, right? that doesn't sync with who you really are. So that will crumble at some stage, because it's not authentic.

And that narrative doesn't work for you. So the narrative that you create, it will only last for a long time when it comes from deep within, and it's authentic. Otherwise, it'll crumble very quickly. Or you're just playing for the gallery, you're playing for the optics, and that will not give you the purposeful life that you're looking at.

Amanda Parker: It's so interesting, because I think people would pick from that gallery, as you put it. Yes. Because they think that somehow this, oh, this must be a better cause as opposed to like just because I care about it That's actually enough if there's something I really care deeply enough about that I want to do that.

I want to bring in the world, you know from The hairdresser who makes people feel and look better [00:31:00] beautiful and feel confident to the chef who puts like divine creations on your plate at the table to whatever the purpose driven entrepreneur who's, you know, saving the planet or whatever it is. So they're all Worthy endeavors that create our life as a whole.

Sharad Lal: Exactly. And that's why purpose is not social service. That the different thing purpose is something that's, it starts with something important to us and it could lead to social service. So let's take Malala. We all know Malala, her example, like if at a young age, you had a gun pointed to you because you couldn't go to school, that becomes a powerful story because of which you say, I don't want other women to suffer it.

So that then comes from a. Deep, authentic place and the energy that brings, and it leads to women empowerment, which is also on the menu, but that comes from very deep within and you're doing good for society, for women, for general society. And I think [00:32:00] that is a great example of purpose versus just picking something out that there's a personal story.

There's a deep meaning or there's something we really love doing that fulfills us. That's the starting point, which many of us miss. That's where you have to go inside for me. to, to find that and then emerge.

Amanda Parker: So Sharad, I understood you're going to share with us that menu of purposes, right?

Sharad Lal: Well, look on any social media that menu is very easily available.

Amanda Parker: So I would love to understand a bit more. So you told us a bit of your origin story, um, but I know you also to be a very successful entrepreneur and businessman. How did you get to be doing this work? here with purpose today. Like what was that journey? How did that start?

Sharad Lal: Great. So that's, that's a very interesting question.

I was like, entrepreneur, one business after another. And when I went through those, when I went through that difficult event and I was trying to find my way [00:33:00] back, I also overcorrected like many people. I thought this achievement mindset that I have is Bullshit. It's a really bad mindset and I want to do away with it.

Money is really bad and I don't want to do anything with money. So I, I went to the other extreme because of which I had great thoughts, but I was, I didn't want fame in any way. So in case if anything interfered and got me fame, I would think I'm doing it for the wrong reasons because I chased fame. a lot earlier.

I chased money a lot earlier and I was saying zero. Now, I don't want to do any of that. At some stage, I realized that this is a complete overcorrection. I'm playing low. If I have things like, let's say an achievement mindset, that's not a bad thing. That's a phenomenal thing. Now, let me see, where do I point this to?

I need not point it to, you know, just getting more and more money. I can point it to something that is a little more meaningful and the achievements become a lot more meaningful. I do not need to play low. So if I want to shine, I still want to be, I still want to [00:34:00] shine. Fame is not that bad, but if it gets completely on top of you, then maybe it's controlling you, but a little bit of feeling good, being respected.

There's nothing wrong in that. Right? So I started finding a middle way. Where, all right, I'm going to use these skills that I'm, that I've developed and some that I've gifted with, and now find a path instead of money, pointed all towards something that is more purposeful. And to me, as I did exercises, I realized that teaching is something that gives me meaning.

Like for me, it's, that's my internal story. I used to love teaching my cousins math. I enjoyed it. I started, I help people in their resumes and helping them get jobs and, you know, in the job. I love that. So my first starting point was actually a nonprofit helping people in their careers and that worked really well.

So that was all on the side while I was still doing my main business, but I was spending a fair amount of time on it. And when I did that, I realized that beyond careers. Especially people, [00:35:00] 35 onwards, as they're getting to their 40s, they're looking for something deeper. It's okay, we can get a career, but can you, I'm looking at what really should I do in life?

Feel like a cog in the wheel, you know, all the things that we talk about, existential crisis, midlife crisis. And I thought that is the bigger opportunity. That's where people, if you can help people there and even help yourself, that's where you can make such a huge impact. And that started becoming interesting for me.

And I was also at the same time reading stuff from spirituality for the first time in my life, psychology, philosophy, doing things, experimenting, coaching, seeing people's stories. And that's where I became very interested in that area. So I got a CEO to run my company. Uh, luckily I was able to do that and I started the podcast at that time just to put it out there and see what happens.

Where I was putting a lot of my thoughts, which many people had played back, Oh, this is great. You should talk more about it. So I said, let me put in a podcast and start putting it out there. That did well. Somebody listened to my podcast and [00:36:00] said, Hey, why can't, why don't you come to my company and give a talk on purpose?

And I was all right. I did that. I tried certain techniques. He helped me get better. And I could see the immediate impact that, Oh, people are getting something interesting out of it. And I realized that, okay, this could be something, it gives me huge fulfillment because firstly, for me, it's a new skill. I'm now learning storytelling, talking in front of people.

Second, it's making an impact that I can see. So it's fulfilling for me. It's making an impact that I can see. And practically in this field, if I do well, it can also pay the bills. And that's when I started going in this line. I still have my agency business where I'm not too focused. I have people running it, but this is the area where I want to develop.

And now my entrepreneurial mind is coming in that how do I sustain and develop it so I can have a lifestyle, do the purposeful good stuff and get the fulfillment. So get all these things kind of, uh, in one place. It's still work in progress, but that's the direction I've chosen for myself. [00:37:00] 

Amanda Parker: Well, I wonder also, um, this is something I'm really curious about because through running this business and the agency that you mentioned.

Yes. It's allowed you to live a life of your choosing. So that is also like an orientation of creating what you want. I know you have a beautiful family, you have beautiful daughters, a beautiful wife, and you're able to live that life through the work, through the business, through the connections that you've made.

I just, because I think we often think that we need to have some altruistic vision of what we're supposed to do in the world, but we don't. a part of what you do in the world can also be lucrative and can support a family and a lifestyle, etc.

Sharad Lal: Such a good point. Whenever I do any of these purpose workshops, I bring it back to practicality because exactly the point that you said, the reason I'm able to do this, it did not happen overnight.

This was something that was developing in parallel for the last [00:38:00] eight, nine years. In 2015, I did a course in coaching and I started the nonprofit in 2014. All this was going on in parallel. I did not quit this job and say, Hey, I need to just do altruistic and go there. Some people can do that and they want to do it, but I did not.

And then when I had understood that, all right, I have made reason, I've got a good amount of savings that I have because I want to give my family a good life, that now I can lean into that. I can get a CEO to run my company. And I got that, well, you can actually get paid reasonably well for speaking. I never knew that when I was doing coaching, I realized, Yes, you can, but it still is difficult in, in, in a Singapore kind of setting.

And then I realized with coaching and speaking, you can make a livelihood as well. So in many ways, leaning more towards this is a calculated decision because it's, there's an idealistic purpose element to it, but there's [00:39:00] a practical, I'm responsible for myself and my family, and I want to give all of us a good life.

So what's the right balance? And that's where it comes in. Tell people, you have to find the right balance on the life that works for you. This is one perspective of life. Purpose, looking internally, looking what's coming up. Another perspective is practicality, living the life that you want for your family, for others.

What is the balance? And that's the way you need to live. I mean, that's the way at least I think we should design our life.

Amanda Parker: Well, I'm always excited to see what you're doing and how you're designing your life because it feels like a road map for me, too. You just keep doing the work, Sharad, and I will just keep watching from the side and going, Hey, that looks pretty neat.

Sharad Lal: But it's all calculated. Yeah. And I'm doing it subconsciously. Because it's, uh, I think we have to think before fully going all in. Though there's some, see, it depends on everyone. Everyone has a different approach. The other approach is, [00:40:00] um, where someone talked, and Derek Sivers also talks about, where you burn the ships there.

You leave what you're doing, you burn the ships that you can't go back, so that you're so committed to doing the new thing that you're doing, that you're not going to go back. I think they're all, we have to see what works for us.

Amanda Parker: I like that. Burn the ships. And the bridges.

Sharad Lal: Bridges you should still keep.

Those are going to be important for you. I don't

Amanda Parker: know. I had a different playbook, I think. What would you say is something that people misunderstand about what you do?

Sharad Lal: I think exactly this, and maybe I'll add to this, exactly this, that I, I don't say that there's one way to live life, which is a purpose oriented life.

I think that's one perspective and why that is quite important to people is because many of us in our life haven't looked inside as what's important to us. And when we do that, we know it, uh, that brings out another perspective, but it's being conscious of these two, the practical and the purposeful aspect, uh, understanding where [00:41:00] we are in life, the stage of life, how we are contributing to other people.

It has, in my view, it has to be a well thought out, well rounded decision. And people miss that. I think about purpose.

Amanda Parker: So I know we touched on this before a little bit, but if someone is listening because they're going to see this is healing with purpose, you know, I'm finally going to get my purpose answers, but in all seriousness, someone who's really thinking they're on this journey, which can be a very painful journey of discovering purpose, you know, Really figuring out what is it that I want to do?

What do I want to contribute to the world? What would you say? I know people can come to your workshops and things like that, but for the average person who's listening and saying, yeah, I really want to get in touch with my purpose. What can they do? What are those maybe first steps that they could take to actually start to find what that is within themselves?

Sharad Lal: Right. I think [00:42:00] it's a step of removing the noise and how it looks for people. And it's good to try a few different things and see what works. One certainly is deep meditation, at least for me. The first time I meditated, I started getting in touch with myself. And if you can do long retreats, you start canceling a lot of the external noises.

So I think that's one. If that doesn't work, journaling is another tool that works very well with just pouring your heart out. And if you do it over a period of time, you start seeing the things that are important to you, which you've been putting away and some sort of pattern start to emerge. I think that's another thing.

There's certainly external help from experts that helps, whether it is therapists or coaches, I think both have a huge role to play. Um, and if you're healing through purpose, that means if you've suffered something that's bad, there is psychological proof of, I don't know if people have heard of, of post traumatic growth, you have post traumatic stress [00:43:00] where because of a traumatic event, of course, you can go through stress and it's difficult to recover, but the other part that people don't talk about too much is post traumatic growth, where once things go so bad that you hit rock bottom.

Another good thing happened, like many bad things happen, but one good thing happens, fear disappears because you can't go even further down. There's no fear. You become fearless. So I would say if people are in that state where they don't care about the world because they're just so shattered. That's a good thing because you don't have fear anymore.

And for me at that time, I could question things that I would have never questioned. Is this who I am? Do these people who I think care about me, do they really care about me? Do I need to be doing this work? Like very, very, very fundamental questions. And that's actually the theory of post traumatic growth as well, because you get shaken at the core, [00:44:00] you question the core, and quite often the core, we realize, has been built by societal expectations, by, it gets built at birth by our parents, by important figures around us, by society.

So that then starts crumbling because we question it. And it's almost like those walls come down. They call it like an earthquake in that when they talk about post traumatic growth, the two guys who studied it forgot their name, but then you can build it up with your own values. And that is where you can give that experience meaning.

So when you build it up with your own values, this is important to me. You emerge having grown through that process, and then you merge with a deeper meaning on what you're meant to do. On things that are important to you. And that's purpose. That's the theory of it. Yeah. Sorry. You were going to ask a question.

Yeah. I just

Amanda Parker: wanted to ask, like, when you're going into deep meditation or reflection, would you, for example, hold the intention? [00:45:00] I want to connect with what's really purposeful for me. Or would you hold a certain intention or question when you do that? I

Sharad Lal: would be open ended. I mean, for me, because if I go like I'm going at that stage, when you're Kind of, let's say when things have gone wrong, there's a lot of emotionals out there.

So I wouldn't try and solve that. One of the things, if I'm going with, I want a purpose because that's going to get me out. I won't try and solve it. It's a by product that comes. All I'm going to do is curio. If, okay, if there's an intention, it's curiosity. What is happening to me? You start looking at the emotions, then who am I, who am I really, what is really important to me?

These are just open and we're not solving them. We're not trying to get anywhere. We go. I think therapy helped me a lot as well, because it poked a lot. Uh, and, and many of us are a certain, we don't know who we are. We don't know who we are not because it's just what we know. And so the therapy starts poking holes into the [00:46:00] narrative of ourselves.

And when we're we're open to that. We're open to listening and seeing. And then processing and over a period of time. So I think it takes time. It takes curiosity and it also takes sitting with this discomfort. We don't have the right answers. We're not trying to answer anything. We're not trying to get anywhere.

We're just sitting out there. It sounds terrible, but you know, you get used to it and very interesting things start emerging. And we slowly build it from that. I don't know if it's helpful, but I guess it's being comfortable in the mess. It's, you know, trying to question things, bring things out, curiosity.

Amanda Parker: It brings to the surface the fact that we don't have the answers and we won't have the answers. Yes. And that we can actually, because what you started with was that you do your best to clear out the noise. And that you really go within to do this meditation reflection journaling because you're getting in touch with yourself.

And [00:47:00] it's not necessarily to solve a specific problem or like the problem of purpose. No, it's really just what matters to me, who am I, what's important and trusting that you don't know yet, and you don't have to know yet. So you're not trying to narrow down that singular answer to the question, but you're just opening up a channel to connect with what I would call like more possibilities, because you don't know.

You're just opening the door to many different things that can come through and finding what really feels, connected and right and good for you.

Sharad Lal: Yes. And when you emerge from that, then again, there's an iterative process. It's not that, Hey, this is the thing like, all right, let me try it out. It's not as good as I thought.

I need to tweak it. I need to do this. And you need to tweak it when you bring it out to the real world, whatever it is, or whatever version of purposeful activities that you want to do. There's a lot of tweaking and iteration and [00:48:00] iteration and tweaking. That's also part of it. So there's iteration inside, there's iteration outside, there's iteration inside.

And you're just enjoying the process of doing it and tweaking it and each time you're getting a little more conscious in what you're doing.

Amanda Parker: It sounds a lot like a spiritual awakening as well. It's a lot of questions and not a whole lot of answers.

Sharad Lal: Exactly. It's absolutely the opposite of what we're used to, the quick answer.

No, unfortunately.

Amanda Parker: We have been lied to our whole lives.

Sharad Lal: Yes.

Amanda Parker: work with you? How do people get in touch? What sorts of engagements are you excited about at this stage of, of your work and your business?

Sharad Lal: I think the best way is, uh, so maybe two ways. One is the podcast. And the second is I'm not, I've stopped doing the individual coaching because I think I can make a bigger impact and I'm learning more on the group stage.

The way [00:49:00] that people can work with me is they can, I can come to their companies and do these workshops. That could be one way to get started. Maybe after a few months, I could launch, I might launch a program, which could be a group program and, and, and let folks know, but it's more group workshops, working with companies.

That's the area I'm working on right now.

Amanda Parker: And so I know that you're based in Singapore. Yes. Do you do these mostly online or in Singapore? Do you travel?

Sharad Lal: So I, I travel and do that. Like will you come to

Amanda Parker: London?

Sharad Lal: Well, if, if, if there's a workshop and if there's an interesting set of people, I can do it in London.

In fact, there's some conversation next month with a few companies in London and even in New York. That could happen next year. But if there's other things where there's demand, certainly, certainly be open to doing that. I've done virtual workshops for London as well as New York.

Amanda Parker: And you can already hear the beauty in your voice because you have such a rich voice.

That is such a pleasure to listen to. So it doesn't matter if you're live on stage or online. [00:50:00] 

Sharad Lal: Thank you.

Amanda Parker: And I'm gonna put a link to everything that you're sharing. So to the podcast, to the website, I follow you on social media. I know that's not your most active channel, but still, everything's going to be in the show notes for this episode.

So you'll be able to learn more from Sharad as he is continuing to expand Purpose driven business, what are you most looking forward to in your future, Shahrod? What is most exciting to you that's coming up on the horizon any, any part of your life?

Sharad Lal: I think it's this project of purpose and bringing it out to the world and I recently started doing it over the last one and a half years.

It's been working well, but how do I bring it out to a bigger audience? How do I tweak what I have right now? I have one workshop. The feedback that I get is it's great. But after five, six days, people go back to the old thing. Can we do a longer program? How do a longer program, which doesn't like Nestle irritate people.

So [00:51:00] I think it's this space. and creating a sustainable business where we're making an impact on people. There's, there's some difference being made on people and being able to do that in scale. I think this is exciting for me.

Amanda Parker: That is very exciting. And I am, as you know, always rooting for you.

Sharad Lal: Thank you, Amanda.

Amanda Parker: So one just last question, if there's any maybe resources or books or podcasts, you've mentioned a few already, but Is there anything you would suggest people take a look at if they're just getting started on this journey? Or maybe anything that's helped you on your journey as well.

Sharad Lal: I think a lot of the books, uh, there are a lot of books on, I think mindfulness is a very simple, most of your listeners might already be familiar with mindfulness, but if you're not, I think that's a good thing to get into this.

So many books that you can read on mindfulness. Um, I think I liked one mindfulness in plain English. It doesn't get talked about a lot. It's a Sri Lankan author. That's, that's a good book to, to read. Um, [00:52:00] I think in terms of podcasts, I like the Tim Ferriss show where it's not Nestle purpose, but he has deep conversations with a whole array of people.

And right now he's doing his best because he's done 10 years. He's doing his best where they have two, two people, uh, two greats from old conversations and podcasts. So there's some very good podcasts out there. There's one which I listened to recently with Jeremy Corona, a coach, excellent podcast, great questions to ask yourself.

So I think those are ways. And then through this, finding your own path, seeing what works better for you and going deeper into it.

Amanda Parker: Beautiful. I am so grateful that you've been here sharing all of this wisdom and insight. I think this is a topic that people can really touch and access in an easy way that it's really present for them often.

And you have such a practical way of bringing that forward that someone really understands. Even if it's not clear what will come [00:53:00] out, they understand how they can really engage. So I really appreciate, first of all, the work that you're doing and then, of course, that you've been here sharing it with us on Don't Step on the Blue Bells.

Sharad Lal: Thank you very much, Amanda. It's always a pleasure talking to you. I mean, even offline, I loved our conversation on my podcast when I had you, it was so much fun. And now I'm back on your podcast. Thank you very much for this conversation, having me. I had a great time speaking with you.

Amanda Parker: Good, then keep trailblazing.

And for everyone who's listening, thanks for tuning in and see you next time. Thanks for tuning in to today's episode of Don't Step on the Blue Bells. If you enjoyed this conversation, please give the podcast a five star rating wherever you listen. And don't forget to hit subscribe and follow along so you never miss a new episode.